Hi everyone,
I was just wondering if members present their views about nirayana bhaav chalit chart and conditions/purposes for which we shud consider bhaav chalit chart.

Which one we shud consider?? Which has got more importance and on what ground??Coz i have met few astrologers who actually hav stopped using lagna chart and base their whole dervations on nirayana bhaav chalit chart only

Please discuss.

Thanking You
Raman

Raman ji,

Since you state that you know some astrologers who have completely stopped looking at charts from lagna (you meant whole sign house system I hope since even in chalit chart the lagna is the first house!), then why not ask them for examples and evidence? Rather than asking on a forum where you are not even sure if anyone is using chalit system.

This is not a new one and keeps coming every so years and belongs to the category of the conundrums which include ayanamsha, karakas, bhav vs signs, KP type cusp at the beginning vs cusp at bhav madhya, KSY, mangal dosh, all the sarpa yogas that have come alive and wriggling all over the body of jyotish, whether to use transsaturnines or not, upapada from 12th-2nd or 5th and on and on.

Here are some of the problems with bhav chalita as understood (or misunderstood but) practiced anyway!

Sripati paddhati used by jyotishis for shadbala and chalit determination is approximate because it is based on actual calculation of two points-- lagna and dashama (MC) and then arc is trisected to give the 11th and 12th cusps and the others determined by taking the opposite cusp (180 degrees). In the UNEQUAL divisioning of the celestial sphere, such approximation is convenient but mathematically not more accurate. Then the KP system which uses Placidius cusps (never explained why?). Placidius is an age old favourite of western astrologers but many of them moved decades ago to finer divisions such as Koch, Zenith, East point, Regiomontanus and many others. This stuff is pretty old and goes back to the writings of Alan Leo and Sepharial that practiced in the 19th and 20th century (early 20th).

Sripati, by the way is identical to Porphyrii system used by Babylonians, I believe or early western astrologers. Some jyotishis also use equal house system which was also used by Ptolemy ages ago.

I can understand why western astrologers would prefer to use house divisions because their zodiac is earth based -- seasonal zodiac. Seasons vary depending on where one is born on earth and so also the influence of the earth-based factors.

Jyotish uses the constellations up in the sky (nirayana) and the 12 divisions are up there and not down here on the earth!

Just in the name of mathematical accuracy people hanker after unequal house divisions and try to force it on jyotish but in doing so, they pick the most approximate way of dividing the houses: sripati/Porphyrii!

I rest my case!!

RR


[quote="Raman Deep Singh"]Hi everyone,
I was just wondering if members present their views about nirayana bhaav chalit chart and conditions/purposes for which we shud consider bhaav chalit chart.

Which one we shud consider?? Which has got more importance and on what ground??Coz i have met few astrologers who actually hav stopped using lagna chart and base their whole dervations on nirayana bhaav chalit chart only

Please discuss.

Thanking You
Raman[/quote]

Oh I forgot to include the other perenneal one: Incorporating transsaturnine planets in jyotish, lock stock and barrel!

RR

[quote="rohiniranjan"]Raman ji,

Since you state that you know some astrologers who have completely stopped looking at charts from lagna (you meant whole sign house system I hope since even in chalit chart the lagna is the first house!), then why not ask them for examples and evidence? Rather than asking on a forum where you are not even sure if anyone is using chalit system.

This is not a new one and keeps coming every so years and belongs to the category of the conundrums which include ayanamsha, karakas, bhav vs signs, KP type cusp at the beginning vs cusp at bhav madhya, KSY, mangal dosh, all the sarpa yogas that have come alive and wriggling all over the body of jyotish, whether to use transsaturnines or not, upapada from 12th-2nd or 5th and on and on.

Here are some of the problems with bhav chalita as understood (or misunderstood but) practiced anyway!

Sripati paddhati used by jyotishis for shadbala and chalit determination is approximate because it is based on actual calculation of two points-- lagna and dashama (MC) and then arc is trisected to give the 11th and 12th cusps and the others determined by taking the opposite cusp (180 degrees). In the UNEQUAL divisioning of the celestial sphere, such approximation is convenient but mathematically not more accurate. Then the KP system which uses Placidius cusps (never explained why?). Placidius is an age old favourite of western astrologers but many of them moved decades ago to finer divisions such as Koch, Zenith, East point, Regiomontanus and many others. This stuff is pretty old and goes back to the writings of Alan Leo and Sepharial that practiced in the 19th and 20th century (early 20th).

Sripati, by the way is identical to Porphyrii system used by Babylonians, I believe or early western astrologers. Some jyotishis also use equal house system which was also used by Ptolemy ages ago.

I can understand why western astrologers would prefer to use house divisions because their zodiac is earth based -- seasonal zodiac. Seasons vary depending on where one is born on earth and so also the influence of the earth-based factors.

Jyotish uses the constellations up in the sky (nirayana) and the 12 divisions are up there and not down here on the earth!

Just in the name of mathematical accuracy people hanker after unequal house divisions and try to force it on jyotish but in doing so, they pick the most approximate way of dividing the houses: sripati/Porphyrii!

I rest my case!!

RR


[quote="Raman Deep Singh"]Hi everyone,
I was just wondering if members present their views about nirayana bhaav chalit chart and conditions/purposes for which we shud consider bhaav chalit chart.

Which one we shud consider?? Which has got more importance and on what ground??Coz i have met few astrologers who actually hav stopped using lagna chart and base their whole dervations on nirayana bhaav chalit chart only

Please discuss.

Thanking You
Raman[/quote][/quote]

Dear Rohiniranjan ji,
Thank you for replying to my query this is a query i am thinking about for a while and yes i did try to find out more about it but could not get much of the information coz not many know about it.And what ever information i got , i didnt wanna to rely on it coz i havnt got any way to confirm it,neither i  found the source to be fully reliable.

What i really meant was that these astrologer dont see D-1 chart but prefer seeing niryana bhaav chalit chart(NBCC) and use it as a basic chart.So they use NBCC as we use D-1 chart.Though one of these guy totally went wrong in my case.Infact he practice one more thing which according to one of ur articles u hate.He considered first house jupiter to be very very auspicious.About the accuracy i personally have only 2-3 accurate instances from the same guy,infact he went very well in case of few other people i know have been to him.Though the reason cud be that in NBCC all planets dnt change their position only the one who r in the starting or last degrees change their position.

One more thing Rohiniranjanji r u planning to write any book or have u already written any book on astrology wud love to read it.Though i do read ur articles which have include quite a good and sensitive topics related to astrology but a book on learning of astrology by you wud be sumthing to read.
By the way i am getting PVR narasimha rao's book tommrow.Would appreciate any furthe advise from you

Thanking You
Raman

Raman ji,

I have already answered the D1/NBCC issue. D1 or V1 (rashi varga) are not all that different, in fact they use the same terrain (rashi) but the walls are drawn a bit differently. The 0 degree and 30 degree forms the whole sign version of D1 while the intercuspal point become the boundaries for the NBCC. And if you are a KP fan then the cusp itself forms the boundary (their houses following the western tropical practice begin with the cusp), so there are three variations of D1.

All that I have written has been freely available and no I have not written nor am I planning to write a 'book' on Jyotish. I do not have the time to find a publisher and then have them micromanage my writings and the rest of nine yards that goes with the process.

From what I have observed, jyotish books and even magazines are not studied seriously by a large majority of readers as is evident from the questions and so on that I have now followed for a couple of decades or so. I realize that there are some very serious and sincere individuals who follow jyotish and whatever is the utility of my writing has been always available to them freely or for a pittance.

I hope you can understand my view-point and hopefully I have answered your curiosity in this matter :-)

RR

[quote="Raman Deep Singh"]Dear Rohiniranjan ji,
Thank you for replying to my query this is a query i am thinking about for a while and yes i did try to find out more about it but could not get much of the information coz not many know about it.And what ever information i got , i didnt wanna to rely on it coz i havnt got any way to confirm it,neither i  found the source to be fully reliable.

What i really meant was that these astrologer dont see D-1 chart but prefer seeing niryana bhaav chalit chart(NBCC) and use it as a basic chart.So they use NBCC as we use D-1 chart.Though one of these guy totally went wrong in my case.Infact he practice one more thing which according to one of ur articles u hate.He considered first house jupiter to be very very auspicious.About the accuracy i personally have only 2-3 accurate instances from the same guy,infact he went very well in case of few other people i know have been to him.Though the reason cud be that in NBCC all planets dnt change their position only the one who r in the starting or last degrees change their position.

One more thing Rohiniranjanji r u planning to write any book or have u already written any book on astrology wud love to read it.Though i do read ur articles which have include quite a good and sensitive topics related to astrology but a book on learning of astrology by you wud be sumthing to read.
By the way i am getting PVR narasimha rao's book tommrow.Would appreciate any furthe advise from you

Thanking You
Raman[/quote]