Hi Guys,

I want us to discuss this topic perhaps in-debth. I see Lotus blossom has particularly referred to the "Egyptian connection". This thread will clarify or bring it into proper perspective.

We attended a meeting hosted by the local Theosophical Soceity, and heard pretty much, what we find in many books. However, there are certain facts which they have researched extensively and much information can be gleaned from that. I presented them with a few questions, which was cleverly diverted at that time.

They tried to run through the Major Arcanum in 3 hours, which we know is totally impossible, (The Fool's Journey). But, I will not discount the theories we were presented with, nor the information freely shared. I also presented them with the 22 halls of Artemis! Unfortunately they could not answer, as it "fell outside their study interest"! This was raised here before, unfortunately to date we have had no further information about this subject.

This is the mail I sent to them, awaiting reply:

"I have been studying Tarot for 10 years already, but as we all know, it's far greater than any of us as individuals and my approach is "we remain students"! To label oneself as a scholar and "master" maybe the way of the fool, in practical terms.  Although we all have a "broader" picture on the history of Tarot as given by Levy, Waite, Crowley, Golden Dawn etc...., the possibilities of being led down a road with "tunnel vision" is also to be considered carefully. I think the eastern influence has to a great extend be "masked" to suit the Hermetic teaching regarding Tarot.

When we consider the link to the Kabbalah, we find a few "flaws", just forgotten! Although we "know-think" the Hebrew Aleph-beth has twenty two letters, we are in a contradictory position regarding the five finals, 23-27. My reasoning around this is simply because the letters are all alpha-numeric and seen in the three spheres of "being", archetypal, existential and cosmic? In regard to this, the Aleph-bet was divided into the 3 spheres, or levels, and recurrent 1-9, 10-18, 19-27, in the groups of "9's" uplifting into the higher levels? The last five letters are mere upliftments, but the numeric value is higher, therefore making it an alpha-numeric letter of it's own value? Now we have the Hermetic or rather Freemason teaching of three sets of seven, as we would find on "Jacob's Ladder", can you give me some clarity on this, or your theory regarding the groupings.

[b]Here we discussed The Chariot briefly at about 11pm:
What also particularly drew my attention, was your indications on the sphinx. The sphinx has always been a symbol of "to conquer" and "soaring into the air", and "resurrection". Once again we are drawn back into Egyptian "mythology" if we may label it so. The symbolic "resurrection" can be seen with the duality of the "Lion's paw" or "Lion's grip", by the inside paw of the dual sphinx's. Here we have a very direct reference to the resurrection of Osiris and the X factor. The X factor can be seen throughout the major Arcanum. Can you shed some light on this?

In the Major Arcanum, we have a great many cards displaying "dualities". This is a point of great interest to me. If you have theoris around this, I would really benefit from it." [/b]

In this discussion, it's most important for our new members to participate and our older members to contribute, after all, we need to learn from each other.

Blessed be.

Hi Guys,

Ok I had a reply and this is what we have:

I have been studying Tarot for 10 years already, but as we all know, it's far greater than any of us as individuals and my approach is "we remain students"! To label oneself as a scholar and "master" maybe the way of the fool, in practical terms. I agree we are all students - but others on the same path will give one labels or titles that may not be deserved.  Although we all have a "broader" picture on the history of Tarot as given by Levy, Waite, Crowley, Golden Dawn etc...., the possibilities of being led down a road with "tunnel vision" is also to be considered carefully. I think the eastern influence has to a great extend be "masked" to suit the Hermetic teaching regarding Tarot. I agree with the idea of tunnel vision therefore it is important to be aware of all approaches and resources to see the overall picture. The Hermetic Wisdom tradition is also fraught with “garden paths” to be led down. The etymological root of the Greek  God Hermes is herma -a pile of stones - in Greek parlance - a myth (someone lunching off the works of Toth and was therefore a messenger of the gods and not really a full god. (Greek mythology depicts him with wings on his feet and helmet. His helmet also made him invisible) Toth, Hermes, Mercury, Hiram (Hirames) all are allegorical figures or (gods). The great Hiram Abif was mixed up with King Solomon and the Phoenician king Hiram of Tire. So which Hermes or Hirames is being referred to with this pure Hermitic Wisdom?
Abraham or A Brahmin - the father of the Jewish and Moslem people, history and fable tells us, came from India via the city of Ur and Alexandria to Israel and was reputed to be the founder of the Oral tradition of Kabbalism. So the whole picture of the purity of Hermetic wisdom becomes very muddied with Egyptian, Chaldean, Greek, Hebrew and Early Roman influence, who’s wisdom traditions are echoed in Indian and Chinese Wisdom Traditions.

From Wikipedia
Thoth was often considered to be the heart, which, according to the ancient Egyptians, is the seat of intelligence or the mind—and tongue of the sun god Ra, as well as the means by which Ra's will was translated into speech He was also related to the Logos of Plato and the mind of God . He played many vital and prominent roles in Egyptian mythology, such as maintaining the universe, and being one of the two deities (the other being Ma'at, who was also his wife) who stood on either side of Ra's boat. In the later history of ancient Egypt, Thoth became heavily associated with the arbitration of godly disputes -the arts of magic, the system of writing, the development of science, and the judgment of the dead.

When we consider the link to the Kabbalah, we find a few "flaws", just forgotten! Although we "know-think" the Hebrew Aleph-beth has twenty two letters, we are in a contradictory position regarding the five finals, 23-27. My reasoning around this is simply because the letters are all alpha-numeric and seen in the three spheres of "being", archetypal, existential and cosmic? In regard to this, the Aleph-bet was divided into the 3 spheres, or levels, and recurrent 1-9, 10-18, 19-27, in the groups of "9's" uplifting into the higher levels? The last five letters are mere upliftments, but the numeric value is higher, therefore making it an alpha-numeric letter of it's own value? Now we have the Hermetic or rather Freemason teaching of three sets of seven, as we would find on "Jacob's Ladder", can you give me some clarity on this, or your theory regarding the groupings. Don’t get too tied up with numerology, it is one of the traps to occupy the mind, as any Kabbalistic Scholar will tell you, Gematria (Hebrew Numerology) takes a study of a life time whereas the information gleaned from this lengthy process of unlocking secrets can be found quickly by alternative means in eastern sources, where their people and priestly class were not faced with perpetual persecution. Initially I recommend a study of the Kabbalistic trinity of Hebrew letters which are Aleph, Mem and Shin (Air Water and Fire) This represents the power of the ocean (mind-emotion-action) which is brought under control by meditation/contemplation and Kabbalistic or yogic breathing techniques. These are the three pillars of the tree of life or man, which when transformed becomes wisdom in action. Ouspenski’s diagram of the Square the physical or base of the Pyramid representing the Minor Arcana, the Triangle representing the spiritual life or Major Arcana and the dot in the middle, the Fool should help you to understand the relevance of this in the Tarot. In Taoism and the alternative I Ch’ing there is Yin Yang and Jen (Human potential) The tree of life with its 22 paths is about the process of liberation and must not be confused with the basic structure of the three pillars around which it is woven.

What also particularly drew my attention, was your indications on the sphinx. The sphinx has always been a symbol of "to conquer" and "soaring into the air", and "resurrection". Once again we are drawn back into Egyptian "mythology" if we may label it so. The symbolic "resurrection" can be seen with the duality of the "Lion's paw" or "Lion's grip", by the inside paw of the dual sphinx's. Here we have a very direct reference to the resurrection of Osiris and the X factor.
I also referred to self discipline as a means of conquering self and self doubt. The answer to the riddle of the sphinx is the riddle of man himself and the need to attain liberation from ones animal and dichotic nature before the onset of dotage. The original X factor was about Egyptian, Chaldean & Kabbalistic Magic also to be found in integral yoga and understood through Patenjeli’s Yoga Sutras and the “Siddhis”
The modern term magic comes from Chaldean, Greek, Persian and Roman sources:
The Greek Magike,  latin Magicus  
The Magi were Zorastrian Priests
The Greek Magos  Sorcerers or wizards
The Old Persian word Magus -magician
The Latin Magus - Wise man/magician or Veneficus - sorcerer(of poisonous magic) or opiates, alkaloids, hemlock etc.
The Modern X Factor is a confused mishmash of occult ceremonial ritual, talismanic devices, crop circles and Hollywood’s fictitious extra terrestrial influences. Plus inyangas, Sangomas, shamans and voodoo. New age thinking is really old age thinking in modern dress exploited by many for economic benefit.

In the Major Arcanum, we have a great many cards displaying "dualities". This is a point of great interest to me. If you have theories around this, I would really benefit from it. I spoke about dualities in the presentation; in that we should rise above duality to understand that both are necessary. There can be no light without dark Ying/Yang etc. The mind separates but does not see their interdependence and thus the unity of both. When we see things with this perspective, all dualities in the Tarot begin to become clear, in other words, to see things without a dichotic mind. Again I refer to Yin Yang and Jen (The human potential) “The mind is the slayer of the real “ (a Sanskrit translation)
One needs a strong and vibrant personality and willpower to escape entrapments and evolve into a spiritual being, which was really the background of my presentation.
Changing oneself is more important than mind games.

Here we have a few explanations, which we can discuss to start with!

Blessed be