Ok folks,

There are certain rules to the universe. Rules we did not write, that have been here far longer then us. Some of those rules are so old we need to rediscover them. There in lies the joy of magick.

I am seeing a tendency, to forget the truths, already discovered and practised for more years then we can imagine in our pithy lives.

If we as people, have led ourserlves to failure, we have done so because we have surrendered the truths established by those before us, on our own altars of ego.

I have seen, read, and heard, how elements can change, at a whim, merely with wish that it is so? How one herb can take on the properties of another, because we desire it so? How there is no difference between onxy and obsidian as long as we visulise them the same. What lazy conciet on our part.

We commit a crime when we think we can reduce or redine the universe, just because we wish it so. It takes work, ardent work, that can not be sacrificed to immeadiate ego.

Therein lies the seperation of those who are, and those who want to be.

you are right.
However the universe is at its root energy and number.
Why not believe that the things you use can be for the purpose intended.
And it doesnt hurt anyone to experiment as long as you are sincere in the
intention of learning the truth and using it as wisely as possible(know thyself).
And after all isnt that the point? to improve or gain something while you are here?
Why be militant about the truth?
The truth will always exist and it can never be subverted to what it isnt.
Therefore you are just trying to start a conflict....Arent you?.

Not sure why you typed this here in symbology?  I see no reference to symbology and i agree with epsilonsmirror that you are spoiling for an argument so i am moving this thread to the jail/prison bit Azamarak.