Q    Well, Master, my point was that though there are quite a few societies, but the average person does not know, is not enlightened enough to go there. We should hold lectures, let us say, at our satsang every week or so, on that subject. They do quite a bit of good and give you so much information which I, myself, learned and I can assure you that my health is due mostly to that. And I do not see why everybody else cannot do that?

A     That is right. You can just suggest that in these meetings, and you can refer others to these books. we have no objection to that. But, our purpose of group meetings is not so much to discuss about health as it is to stress spirituality. Otherwise, we may deviate from the real subject---that is what I fear. For instance, if we start telling how to cook good food, or how satsangis should dress, and we start giving demonstrations of all that---well, we are lost. Where is the time for all this, and where will there be an end to all these things?

Q      I do not mean all the time, only occasionally, once in a while?

A      I have no objection. You may discuss anything from the health point of view. Or, you can say that these exercises have helped you, these books have helped you. Then if anybody else is interested, he can join those organizations, or he can read those books from the health point of view. You people meet just once a month, or once a week, and just for about an hour or so. In this little time, how can you discuss all these multipurpose activities of our daily needs? It is always good to discuss spirituality, because the purpose of the group meeting is to build that atmosphere in which we have to live for meditation. We should not do anything which deviates our attention from that meditation we have to build that atmosphere of meditation around us by reading Sant Mat literature, by giving help to each other. We should always be helpful to each other. We should try to create in ourselves love and devotion for the Lord, and help the new students on the path so that they too can live in that atmosphere of meditation. That is the object of these group meetings --- nothing else. But, if there is disharmony, unpleasantness, or bossing in the group meetings, I do not think that you practically gain anything from such group meetings at all.

Another point to consider is that other people may not feel inclined to hear about health or cooking, or other things. They may say that all these other things can be learned in other schools is about meditation, about spirituality, and that is the purpose for which they come here. We are not against talking about health, or how to breathe, or how to exercise; but there are so many other places where we can learn these things.

If anybody needs help, whether spiritual, mental or physical, and we are able to help, we should always do so. But what I mean is that we should not be lost in so many activities that we forget the real purpose of these meetings. The real purpose is to create love and devotion, because a healthy, good atmosphere of love and devotion is very essential for meditation. There should always be love and harmony in your groups. You should be helpful to each other, and a new seeker coming and entering in your hall should automatically realize the difference between other organizations and your organization. You can help them in health and in your organization. You can help them in health and in cooking matters too. I have seen your magazines. They publish all those recipes for cooking and all that. These are useful for practical purposes, but we need not waste time in discussing these things in our meetings.

Q     But people have to be informed. Of course, they are not ignorant, but they are misguided. They are not informed about health, and neither was I many years ago.

A     I mean, if the impression in satsang is that we have to ignore health, that is wrong. We have to look after our health, but the purpose of keeping healthy is meditation. The object should be kept in view; that object should not be lost; that destination we should not forget. Health we have to maintain. Everybody needs health. But, we cannot teach all these things. We should discuss only the spirituality, which is the food for the soul and the mind. Other things automatically come to us when the love of the Lord and devotion comes in us. We should not lose time in those discussions; those other things we can always learn elsewhere.

Q     Should one rotate the meetings from one home to another, or should one just keep them where it is most practical, where there are no little children to bother?

A     This depends upon your own environment. If people feel that they do not want to come to a particular house, always, well, they can shift to other person who wants you to hold some meetings at his own place. These are all small things that can be decided mutually. When you will be happy to oblige anybody, they will be happy to oblige you, always, because everyone wants to live in that environment, in that atmosphere of harmony and peace.

Q      I would like to know why, if a person practices the Commandments, and does good to every one regardless of whether they be good or back, why is it that he has to abstain from meat?

A      Sister, I will explain to you. All that you see in the world can be divided into five divisions or categories, based on the five elements -- earth, water, fire, air and ether. The human body is made up of all five elements, but the soul, the essence of the Lord, gives it life. Because it is only the human body that contains all five elements, it is called the top of creation.

The first division is that of the plant kingdom, the main or active element of which is water. The second is that of insects, reptiles and worms which live under the ground. They have most active in them elements of earth and fire. Fowl, including all types of birds belong to the third class, and the three elements most active in them are water, fire and air.Those belonging to the fourth category are the four-legged animals, such as cows, buffalos, horses, and the like. They lack only ether, the power of discretion. Human beings are in the fifth class, at the very top of creation, as all the five elements are active in them.

One's feeling is in proportion to the number of elements that are active and the degree to which they are active. For example, if you pluck a flower from the garden of your neighbor, there will be no punishment. She will onyl abuse you or frown at you, or you will just incur her displeasure. If you kill her chicken, she may file a suit and you may be fined; if you kill a human being you may be hanged or receive some other form of capital punishment. However, in this world, we can never live on the dead; the living can live only on the living. We cannot live by eating stones, nor can we live just by drinking water or by breathing air. Life has to live on life. So, the saints advise us to collectg the least amount of karma while living in this world, and for that reason they advise us to live on fruits and vegetables. They belong to the first division, and even they have souls, but the karma involved by eating them is not as great as that which we would incur by living on or in any way destroying the life contained in those belonging to the other categories.

Yet it is impossible to live in this world without some so-called innocent killing; as, for instance, when we walk we kill insects; when we talk we kill insects; when we breathe we kill insects, though they are not visible to the naked eye. This whole room is filled with creatures; we are killing these creatures without even realizing it. We are killing by talking, by breathing and even when shaking hands. Whatever we are doing, we are killing. The room is full of souls.

If you are given a hundred and eighty pounds of weight to carry, you will be crushed under it and will not be able to go even a step. So, saints always advise us to collect the least amount of karma. That means that because we have to live and we can live only on the living, they advise us to collect the least possible load. That is why we depend upon plant life, which is a very insignificant amount of karma to collect and which can be cleared with even one or two days' meditation.

If on the one hand we are meditating, and on the other hand we are killing every day, we are only balancing what we are doing and we are back where we started. How to get rid of the load we are carrying? We are advised not to collect anything for the future, and whatever we have already collected, to clear it with meditation. Then only we can go back to the Lord. That is why we are vegetarian.

Q     Master, do you advise a vegetarian diet?

A     There is no question of whether or not I advise it. We must follow it. There is no other way for spiritual progress. If you have only a shirt on your back, you can run; but if you are given a tremendous load, you cannot even take a step. As life must live on life in this world, the saints say that we shoul limit our intake to things containing one element, and that means vegetation, the plant kingdom. We should try to take the least burden from this world, just like wearing a light shirt, which does not bother you, as you do not feel that load. we should not accumulate so much bad karma, such as by killing, by eating meate, that we are just crushed under it and cannot make any spiritual progress.

If we kill, we will be killed. We should never forget that. Christ said, "Love thy neighbor." All creatures are our neighbors. The surroundings in which we are living, that is, the whole universe is our neighbor. When you love anybody, you do not kill that indiviual, and when we love the whole creation, we cannot kill intentionally nor could we find it in our heart to have it done for us by someone else.

Q     But why can we not eat an infertile egg? We are not killing?

A     I know that infertile eggs have no life, and from that standpoint you can justify it. But when you start with that, you start with the other also. You get the taste of that and there will be no end to it. If you just start innocently with a kiss, you do not know where you will end, so then you start justifying things. It is better to be strict, and when we are strict about a certain thing, there we become just a little loose in this way or that way, we do not know where it leads to. Besides, the eating of even an infertile egg hardens themind by exciting animal instincts, which are antagonistic to spiritual progress.

Q     Master, if an intiate should stray from the vegetarian diet after two or three years after initiation, what would be the effect on the initiate?

A     I think you have given quite a latitude -- two or three years. You are perhaps referring to your wife, who was initiated today?

Q     No, No. I am interested in all of us.

A     Then why worry at all? Why should an initiate at all stray from the vegetarian diet? Why worry about this question? If a child commits a mistake, even a little crime, the father does not hand him over to the police. But the father never hesitates to spank him, to beat him or to punish him in some  way in order to set him right, to reform him; but he will never hand him over to the police or to the jail authorities. So, if we fall, we do not go back but we have to pay for that. We are given punishment just for our reformation. A mother loves the child most, but still she has to keep him right. Sometimes she has to spank him --- not because she hates him, but because she loves him and wants to keep him disciplined, to set him right. So, in the same way, the Master also admonishes us, and we have to face the consequences of what we do, but he does it with a loving hand and with loving care, just for our own advantage.


Q      Master, what is the responsibility of a satsangi when he has a guest either in his home or in a public eating place, for providing for that guest? Supposing that the guest wants meat?

A      Brothers, you do what is possible under the circumstances. You see, sometimes we are caught up in such situations, and we find it practically impossible to escape. We do it, but we are not happy that we are doing it. Then we try to avoid or escape from such situations where we are not happy about what we have to do. When we ourselves do not eat or drink what is harmful
to spiritual progress, there is no reason why we should serve it to others. If we are doing it, perhaps we are not happy within ourselves. If you are not happy within yourself that you are doing it, a time will come when you will refuse to live against yourself; you will refuse to do it; you would like to avoid it.

Q      It is better then that we should not want to do that?

A      If you feel guilty about doing it, then you should not do it. If you honestly feel that it is all right under the circumstances, I do not bother, I do not mind, go on doing it. You should not do anything that makes you carry a sense of guilt with you, for that will not let you sit in meditation, it will not let you live with yourself, and it will not let you be happy. We should always do the best we can under the circumstances. Sometimes we are caught in such a net that we find it difficult to escape. We just have to do what is practically possible in that situation. We do nmany things which we cannot justify, which we should not justify, but we have to do them. But the law of karma, all the same will take its own course.

Q      Maharaj Ji, when a satsangi is having friends at home and his particular friend delights in eating meat and things other than fruit and vegetables, should a satsangi serve meat to his friends --- when he has to invite them to his home?

A      Brother, it depends on the situation. If he has to do it, let him do it. But the main thing is that we are not to take it ourselves. And I tell you, when we do not take it ourselves, we are never happy to do all these things. What is the use of serving anybody meat or drink, if you carry that sense of guilt always with you of what you have done? Then you do not live with yourself. You are torturing yourself. You are unhappy with yourself, and gradually, perhaps you yourself being to take it. You will not be happy in such circumstances. You will noot be happy in that atmosphere or company.

Q      Then it is best that you let them know that in your home none of these things are served?

A      I tell you, it is much better to be strong within yourself. There is no need to feel inferior in this society that we are vegetarian and do not drink, also that we do not serve such things. If people do not really love you, you have no concern with them. Do not bother about them. If they are interested in you, they will respect your principles. They will respect your feelings. And if you think they are not interested in you to that extent, I do not think they are even worth meeting.


Q      If somebody serves meat to his children or to other people or to friends, or liquor to other people, is this a demerit to him, or to the people who eat or who drink?

A      It is a vicious circle. It is bad for both. You see, in any way, what its spiritual effect is? When you yourself do not eat meat and do not drink, you yourself are never happy to serve these things. As a result you always carry happy to serve these things. As a result you always carry a feeling of guilt in you, and that in itself becomes a block in your progress. You are not happy with yourself; you are never happy in such situations, and naturally, when your mind is always feeling like that, you will never concentrate, you will never make progress as long as you are carrying that feeling of guilt with you. So, why not just throw it away by discontinuing to do those things that make you feel like that?

Q       Now, taking the reverse situation, when people invite you to their homes and they eat meat, and of course, the satsangi does not eat meat, and of course, the satsangi does not eat meat, what is the situation in regard to him when he gets the odor of meat right under his nose?

A       We have to live in this world. We cannot convert the whole world to our own view, to our own way of thinking. You have to make the bestuse of the situation to the extent that you should not take it yourself. You do not bother about what they do. You are to be strict only with yourself. You are responsible for yourself, you are not responsible for the world. You cannot solve the problems of the world, but you can rise above those problems and not let them affect you. You are only concerned with your own food. Let them do whatever they want to do.

Q      How should one answer a friend who says that I know that eating meat is wrong; however, more bad karma is made by hurting the feelings of host or hostess than by eating meat?

A      You can just pity him, that is all. I assure you that when we stand on Sant Mat principles, we are not hurting others, not even a little bit, for our principles. Actually when our beloveds and our friends know our principles, if they are not interested in us, I do not think we should bother about them at all. we should not compromise with our principles. Our real friends will always appreciate and respect our principles, because they love us and they always like to do what pleases us. Otherwise, if they are selfish, you can easily be indifferent to them.

Q    Master, what is the simplest way to explain to one's children the reason for not eating meat?

A    I think the simplest way is just to set ourselves up as an example to our children. They do not want any reasoning when they see that the parents do not eat meat. Generally, they try to do what the parents do, and we can explain to them from the humane point of view that it is not kind but it is cruel to kill anybody. I know of a particular example: When my sister wasnewly married, her husband used to take meat. Though, of course, she was an initiate and did not eat it, yet she did not like to interfere in his life, and when she got a child, her husband tried to rear the child according to his own views. My sister, of course, never liked that: so one day when her husband was out, the sservants were going to kill a chicken, and she took her son right to the spot. Naturally, the chicken was crying out and resisting, and the child just could not stand it. After that he automatically became a vegetarian in spite of his father's persuasions, and ultimately the father also became an initiate.



Children do not know what they are eating, but if they know how these chickens and animals are being killed and slain, and what they have to go through, probably the children would never eat meat. Their heart is so sensitive and tender that they cannot stand it. So, I think it is more or less for the parents to explain to them, or to be an example to them, but not to insist too much, especially to this modern generation. You see, they do not want any decisioins; they like to think that it is their own decision, but we have to prepare them for such good decisions.

Q    A friend of mine has a little grandchild of three and that grandchild has never been told that they are vegetarian, but he will not eat meat and he tells his grandmother it is not right to eat meat. Is that a memory?

A    This is due to associations with a past life. We call them 'sanskaras', impressions of a past life. Sometimes they come along with us into this world, and we automatically have such an abhorrence to these things that we cannot do it in spite of our best efforts.

Q    What can I do about my children who prefer to have meat in their diet on occasions? I would rather not have it in my home.

A    Well, sister, this is naturally a problem. You, and not your children, have taken a decision to follow a path. So, as far as you are concerned, you should never compromise with your principles. You have to be strict with your principles. As the dutyof a mother to her children, if they want it, I would advise you not to shirk your duty to serve them; but if you can explain to them, if you can advise them and you can put them on the vegetarian diet, perhaps you will be happy and they will be happy. If you cannot do it, you should not worry about it at all. But you should never compromise with your own principles.

Q     Master, I have two very small children, and it does not concern my husband or myself to give up meat. But when people hear that we are not giving meat to our young children, in our society, we are made to feel a little that we are depriving them of nutrition. A few words from you would put our minds at ease. For a young child, is a vegetarian diet sufficient?

A     Well, sister, you can bring up your children in any way you life. Many people who have never tasted meat in their life are in better health than those who have taken it. It is the responsibility of the parents as to what they want to give to the child. The child himself has to make his own decisions when he becomes mature. Then you leave it to him what he wants to do. As far as Sant Mat is concerned, we are only concerned with the initiates. They are not to compromise with the diet, but with others we are not concerned at all.

Q      But, if I were thinking of initiation at some time, would it be better for me to keep my children vegetarian?

A      No, you have only to pledge for yourself. You have no right to pledge for anybody else. What you do not do for yourelf you will always hate to do for others. It is for the parents to decide what is best for the children until they are mature. Then they can decide for themselves what they want and what they do not want. We are only concerned with the seekers, with the initiates. The initiate has to take a pledge to be vegetarian.

Q      If you bring somebody into this world and you are on the path, and you do not feed him according to the path, who suffers the karma, you or the child?

A      If you do not put the children on a vegetarian diet, then it may be due to the karmas of both of you. The child and you, yourself, are both responsible for it. But it is his karma. If it is not in his karma, he will never eat meat, even from birth. If he is destined not to eat meat, he will be born only in that family where no meat is served. For example, I have never tasted meat or eggs in my life, and my father never tasted meat or egg. Luckily we were born in that family. We could not do anything about it if we were born in America. So, the karma is there. That becomes destiny. That karma brings us automatically where we are to face that particular type of karma. When one's time comes, he will automatically shed all feares and will be on the path with the vegetarian diet.

Q      Mater, you said that we should not have alcohol. Does this mean that if we were sick and the doctor gave us some medicine containing narcotic, does it do the same thing?

A      If from the health point of view a doctor sometimes recommends, take it, but one should not be addicted to it. It should not become a habit. Some people take narcotics and all that, thinking that by doing so they keep up their strength, or morale. That is not right.